FAQ: Difference between revisions

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=== The grammar seems very simple. Am I overlooking something? ===
__NOEDITSECTION__
✅ It is simple! You do not need to learn a lot of rules to be able to say a lot. More bang for your buck.
This page answers some '''frequently asked questions''' about Toaq.


=== How many tones are there? ===
== Getting started ==
✅ 4 tones.
=== Where do I start learning? ===
; See article: [[Tone]]
Try [[Toaq with Ease]] or the [[Grammar overview]]. The most complete resource is the [[refgram]].


=== What does tone X do? ===
=== "Complementizer"? "Covert"? I don't understand the refgram at all! ===
✅ See the following table:
Don't worry, that's okay! It was written for an audience of linguists, not language learners. Focus on the example sentences if you feel lost in the jargon. If you don't understand a concept, try searching this wiki. You can also ask questions on [[Discord]].
{| class="wikitable"
 
|-
=== How do I type the tone marks/symbols/diacritics? ===
!
See [[Input methods]].
!Falling tone {{done|1}}
 
!Rising tone {{done|2}}
=== What's the word for... ===
!Glottal tone {{done|3}}
You can look it up on [[Toadua]], the community dictionary.
!Rising-falling tone {{done|4}}
 
|-
== Speaking and writing ==
! [[Verb]]
=== How many tones are there? What does each tone do? ===
|<ul><li>[[Verbal complex]] <li>[[Serial]] tail <li>[[Adjective]] <li> [[Determiner]] complement</ul>
There are four tones, but each one has various uses depending on the part of speech they are used with. Simplifying things a lot, {{Done|1}} is for particles and verbs, {{Done|2}} is for particles and (pro)nouns, {{Done|3}} marks subordination, and {{Done|4}} is for adverbs. See [[Tone]] for a thorough overview. <!--{{Tone table}}-->
| [[Bound variable]]
 
| style="background:#ccc" |
=== How do you pronounce…? ===
|[[Adjunct]]
Please refer to https://toaq.net/refgram/phonology/.
|-
 
![[Pronoun]]
=== What's up with the letter {{t|q}} in this language? Pronunciation of {{t|q}} ===
| style="background:#ccc" |
{{t|q}} is somewhat special and its pronunciation may not be immediately obvious. It is pronounced like English ⟨ng⟩ (IPA [ŋ]). The use of the letter Q is a nod to [https://loglangs.wiki/Ceqli Rex May’s Ceqli], an international auxiliary language with loglang elements; it’s also found in natural languages such as Fijian (where it represents [ᵑɡ], to be exact).
|Argument
 
| style="background:#ccc" |
=== What's with the ı / i without dot / dotless i? ===
|[[Incorporated object]]
Writing ı without the dot distinguishes it more from an i that carries a tone mark, it also makes more room for an adjacent tone mark. Overall, it just makes things easier to read. See [[Latin writing system]].
|-
 
![[Determiner]]
== Grammar ==
| style="background:#ccc" |
=== Can I fill fewer slots than a verb has? ===
|Argument
Probably! See [[Underfilling]].
| style="background:#ccc" |
 
|[[Incorporated object]]
=== How do I skip slots? (What's the equivalent of Lojban's <code>FA</code>?) ===
|-
While not an exact equivalent of Lojban’s <code>FA</code>, if you need to access the last slot of a verb, you can use [[Object incorporation]]. Alternatively, just fill the slots with [[pronoun]]s.
![[Complementizer]]
 
|[[Speech act]] complement
=== How does {{t|bọ}} work? What is the meaning / place structure of {{t|bọdo}}? ===
| style="background:#ccc" |
Semi-officially, it moves the direct object to the front, and removes the old subject. See [[bo-]].
|[[Subclause]] head
 
|[[Incorporated object]]
=== How do numbers work? ===
|-
The official number system is that numbers are just verbs: {{t|saq}} means "___ are three in number", so {{t|Saq jío}} means "the buildings are three" and {{t|sá jıo saq}} means "some buildings that are three" (three buildings).
! [[Interjection]]
 
|Interjection
A more elaborate unofficial number system is described at [[User:Loekıa/Numbers]].
|Inquiry
 
| style="background:#ccc" |
=== How do I refer back to {{t|sá}} without a following verb? Does it bind {{t|ráı}}? ===
|Expression of empathy
No, you have to use {{t|hụ́sa}}.
|-
 
![[Speech act particle]]
<!--
| colspan="4" | Lexical tone (i.e. {{Derani||da}} and {{Derani||dâ}} are simply different lexemes)
 
|-
=== What's the difference between an indirect question and a {{t|ꝡé}} phrase? ===
![[Focus particle]]
The distinction is extremely important logically speaking, but English usually conflates the two, so many people overlook the difference. The following example illustrates the difference:
| colspan="4" |Steals tone from head if possible, otherwise echoes it
# {{t|Dua jí ꝡä chı súq hí raı.}} = "I know ''what'' you believe"
|-
# {{t|Dua jí ꝡé chı súq hóa.}} = "I ''know'' what you believe"
![[Conjunction]]
Let's say that what you believe is [God exists].
| Highest precedence
# says that I know that you believe [God exists], because I know what it is that you believe
| Default precedence
# says that I know that [God exists] is true, because I know that which you believe to be true.
| style="background:#ccc" |
-->
|Second highest precedence
 
|}
== Tools and resources ==
=== How do you pronounce X? ===
 
✅ Please refer to https://toaq.net/refgram/phonology/.
=== Is there a way to check whether my sentence is correct? / Is there a translator from Toaq to logic notation? ===
You can use [[Kuna]]'s web interface [https://toaq.net/kuna/ here].
 
=== How can I join the [[Discord]] server? ===
Use [https://discord.gg/qDqDsH9 this invite link].


=== Is there a way to check whether my sentence is correct? ===
=== Is there a frequency list? ===
✅ Yes, using one of the online parsers:
Yes! See [https://github.com/toaq/corpus/blob/main/frequency-list.txt frequency-list.txt] in the [https://github.com/toaq/corpus/ corpus] repo.
* https://toaq.net/zugai/ (Gamma, in-development, may lack some features, but produces detailed output)
* https://toaq.net/peg/ (Beta, produces a simplistic tree; may accept some incorrect inputs)
* https://toaq.herokuapp.com/ (outdated)


If you're on [[Discord]] or Telegram, you can also use commands like <code>%english %logic %structure</code> (for [[Zugaı]]) and <code>%miu</code> for the outdated [[Mıu]]; [[Nuogaı|more bot commands are listed here]].
=== Is there a list of translated sentences? ===
[https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1bCQoaX02ZyaElHiiMcKHFemO4eV1MEYmYloYZgOAhac/edit#gid=1395088029 This spreadsheet] has up-to-date example sentences in the "Refgram examples" and "A sentences" sheets. <!--


=== How do I type the tone marks/symbols/diacritics? ===
✅ Please see [[Input methods]].
=== Where does the Toaq logo come from? ===
=== Where does the Toaq logo come from? ===
✅ It's original.
✅ It's original.
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=== How are roots created? ===
=== How are roots created? ===
✅ A priori, based on my intuition. I usually have to think long and hard and feel my options out before I decide what root to assign to a concept.
✅ The author described the process as: "A priori, based on my intuition. I usually have to think long and hard and feel my options out before I decide what root to assign to a concept."
 
Recently, many words are created by community consensus on [[Toadua]], including root words, using a variety of methods.


=== Where can I find a dictionary? ===
=== Where can I find a dictionary? ===
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| nho || zı
| nho || zı
|-
|-
| jẽo || bũ
| Nu da. || Bu nu da.
|-
| Nủ da. || Bủ nủ da.
|-
|-
| Jẻo hóq da. || Bủ hóq da.
| Juna hóq da. || Sahu hóq da.
|}
|}


=== Is Toaq easy/difficult/hard? ===
✅ If you can handle the tones, which I believe anyone can, then it's really not a difficult language to become decent at.


=== X seems to be missing from the language. Why does Toaq not have X? ===
=== X seems to be missing from the language. Why does Toaq not have X? ===
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=== What's the vowel order? ===
=== What's the vowel order? ===
✅ {{t|A U I O E}}
✅ {{t|A U I O E}}
-->


=== How can I join the discord server? ===
<!--
✅ Use this invite link: https://discord.gg/qDqDsH9
=== What's the terminator of X? ===
; See article: [[Discord]]
✅ Unlike some other loglangs like Lojban and Loglan, modern Toaq doesn't feature any terminators at all! Instead, clauses can be closed by [[Auto-terminating clauses|filling every argument]], [[cleft]] structures, and connecting with a [[conjunction]] to another clause in the same scope.
 
=== How can I join the Telegram groups? ===
✅ Use these invite links:
* ✅ general: https://t.me/joinchat/CWpuWUMl0JeW7-TdO6PnAQ
* ✅ chiejio: https://t.me/joinchat/CWpuWUPKUdAiT7KR6SiE7w
* ✅ toaq-only: https://t.me/joinchat/CWpuWUSC9pqnzPyufkQsrA
* ✅ toashuaq: https://t.me/joinchat/CWpuWUvrHSdLL3JneDjp9Q
* ✅ off-topic: https://t.me/joinchat/CWpuWVJC8_-EMukIAjMfYQ
 
=== What's a tonal pangram? ===
✅ In the broadest sense, a tonal pangram is a sentence that contains each tone at least once. In a more narrow sense, it is a sentence that contains each tone exactly once. The latter is a form of Toaq poetry.


=== Is there an automatic interpreter of Toaq? Is there a translator from Toaq to logic notation? ===
=== Is there an automatic interpreter of Toaq? Is there a translator from Toaq to logic notation? ===
✅ Indeed there is!
✅ Indeed there is (for a slightly outdated version of Toaq called [[Toaq Gamma]])!


Go to https://toaq.net/zugai/ and select logic. Note that Zugaı is still in development, so some things may not work as expected.
Go to https://toaq.net/zugai/ and select logic. Note that Zugaı is still in development, so some things may not work as expected.
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| 83 || = || {{t|roaıheı saq}}
| 83 || = || {{t|roaıheı saq}}
|}
|}
-->


=== What's with the ı / i without dot / dotless i? ===
<!--
✅ Writing ı without the dot distinguishes it more from an i that carries a tone mark, it also makes more room for an adjacent tone mark. Overall, it just makes things easier to read.
; See article: [[Latin writing system]]
 
=== How do I do an indirect quote? ===
=== How do I do an indirect quote? ===
✅ Use {{T|ꝡä}}+predicate with {{T|ruaq}} or {{T|duatua}} for indirect assertions and {{T|duasue}} for indirect questions:
✅ Use {{T|ꝡä}}+predicate with {{T|ruaq}} or {{T|duatua}} for indirect assertions and {{T|duasue}} for indirect questions:
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=== Is there a memrise deck? ===
=== Is there a memrise deck? ===
✅ There is, but it is outdated: https://www.memrise.com/course/1974691/toaq-simple-predicates-2018-06-03/
✅ There is, but it is outdated: https://www.memrise.com/course/1974691/toaq-simple-predicates-2018-06-03/
-->


=== Is there a frequency list? ===
<!--
✅ Why yes! Look here: https://gist.github.com/lynn/c8c6f904d4e5c29a6b2533a7ac05680a
 
=== What is the meaning of an m with a tone mark? ===
✅ If you see an m with a tone mark, chances are it's used as an interjection of sorts. We're still experimenting with it. One suggestion was the following:
{|
| {{t|ḿ}} || > || huh?, wonder, surprise
|-
| {{t|m̉}} || > || roger, gotcha, ok
|-
| {{t|m̂}} || > || aha!, discovery
|-
| {{t|m̀}} || > || slight disappointment
|-
| {{t|m̃}} || > || no, disagreement
|}
 
=== Is there a list of translated sentences? ===
✅ We are working on it!
 
See: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1bCQoaX02ZyaElHiiMcKHFemO4eV1MEYmYloYZgOAhac/edit#gid=1395088029
 
=== Is there a subreddit? ===
=== Is there a subreddit? ===
✅ Yes: https://old.reddit.com/r/Toaq/
✅ Yes: https://old.reddit.com/r/Toaq/
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|-
|-
| colspan=2 | || you        || colspan=2 | || = || {{t|súq}}  || ''you''
| colspan=2 | || you        || colspan=2 | || = || {{t|súq}}  || ''you''
|-
| colspan=2 | || you        || colspan=2 | || = || {{t|súna}}  || ''you'' (plural)
|-
|-
| colspan=4 |                || they        || = || {{t|nháo}} || ''they/them, he/him, she/her''
| colspan=4 |                || they        || = || {{t|nháo}} || ''they/them, he/him, she/her''
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|=
|=
|{{T|nhána}}
|{{T|nhána}}
|they/them (plural)
|''they/them'' (plural)
|-
|-
| colspan="2" | || you        || + || they  || = || {{t|súo}}  || ''you all''
| colspan="2" | || you        || + || they  || = || {{t|súo}}  || ''you all''
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| me          || + || you    || colspan=2 | || = || {{t|úmı}}  || ''we, us''
| me          || + || you    || colspan=2 | || = || {{t|úmı}}  || ''we, us''
|-
|-
| me          || colspan=2 | || + || they  || = || {{t|ínhe}} || ''we, us''
| me          || colspan=2 | || + || they  || = || {{t|íme}} || ''we, us''
|-
|-
| me          || + || you    || + || they  || = || {{t|ámao}} || ''we, us''
| me          || + || you    || + || they  || = || {{t|áma}} || ''we, us''
|}
|}
; See article: [[Pronoun]]
; See article: [[Pronoun]]
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*: Example: {{t|jío puq}} "the [more than one] buildings" (explicit plural).
*: Example: {{t|jío puq}} "the [more than one] buildings" (explicit plural).
Marking number is never required. It is usually obvious (or not terribly important) whether something is one thing or more than one thing. When in doubt, read a bare noun as plural unless context suggests otherwise.  
Marking number is never required. It is usually obvious (or not terribly important) whether something is one thing or more than one thing. When in doubt, read a bare noun as plural unless context suggests otherwise.  
-->


=== What does it mean when a function word is written in all caps? / What function word classes are there? ===
<!-- Unlike previous versions of Toaq, {{t|q}} does not have any allophonic variation - that is, it is always [ŋ] - because syllables may also end with {{t|m}}, which needs to stay distinct. -->
✅ In discussions about Toaq grammar, a function word in all caps usually refers to a function word class. Function words that share the same grammar are grouped together in a class. This class is usually named after its most prominent member. For example, the words {{t|da, ba, ka and moq}} have the same grammar, and their class is named {{class|da}}. We say, for instance, that "{{t|móq}} is in {{class|da}}".
 
Knowing these classes is useful, because once you have learned how to use one member of a class, you automatically know how to use every other member of the same class, too (syntactically speaking). If a sentence is grammatically correct with one member of a class, then substituting it with any other member of the same class will retain the same grammatical structure. The grammar does not distinguish between individual members of a class.
 
; See article: [[Particle]]
 
These are the classes and their members:
{|
| {{class|da}}  || {{t|da}}, {{t|ba}}, {{t|ka}}, {{t|móq}}, {{t|nha}}, {{t|ꝡó}}
|-
| {{class|sa}}  || {{t|sá}}, {{t|sía}}, {{t|tú}}, {{t|túq}}, {{t|já}}, {{t|ké}}, {{t|hí}}, {{t|báq}}, {{t|hú}}, {{t|ní}}
|-
| {{class|ru}}  || {{t|rú}}, {{t|rá}}, {{t|ró}}, {{t|rí}}, {{t|róı}}, {{t|kéo}}
|-
| {{class|to}}  || {{t|to}}
|-
| {{class|ꝡa}}  || {{t|ꝡa}}, {{t|ma}}, {{t|tıo}}
|-
| {{class|bı}}  || {{t|bı}}
|-
| {{class|po}}  || {{t|po}}, {{t|jeı}}, {{t|mea}}
|-
| {{class|ju}}  || {{t|ju}}, {{t|la}}
|-
| {{class|ku}}  || {{t|ku}}, {{t|beı}}, {{t|mao}}, {{t|tou}}, {{t|juaq}}
|-
| {{class|hu}}  || {{t|hu}}, {{t|jıbı}}/{{t|jıy}}
|-
| {{class|kıo}} || ({{t|kıo}}
|-
| {{class|kı}}  || {{t|kı}}
|-
| {{class|mı}}  || {{t|mı}}, {{t|mıru}}
|-
| {{class|mo}}  || {{t|mo}}
|-
| {{class|teo}} || {{t|teo}}
|-
| {{class|shu}} || {{t|shu}}
|-
| {{class|na}}  || {{t|na}}
|}
 
=== What's up with the letter {{t|q}} in this language? Pronunciation / allophones of {{t|q}} ===
✅ {{t|q}} is somewhat special and its pronunciation may not be immediately obvious. It is usually pronounced like English ⟨ng⟩ (IPA [ŋ]), but it has the optional allophones [n] and [m]. The use of the letter Q is a nod to [https://loglangs.wiki/Ceqli Rex May’s Ceqli], an international auxiliary language with loglang elements; it’s also found in natural languages such as Fijian (where it represents [ᵑɡ], to be exact).
 
The [n] and [m] allophones these rules:
* The default pronunciation is IPA [ŋ], and it keeps this pronunciation before {{t|m, f, n, s, r, l, nh, sh, g, k, ', h}}, and at the end of a breath group.
* Before {{t|d, t, z, c, j, ch}}, it is pronounced [n].
* Before {{t|b, p}}, it is pronounced [m].
Examples:
: {{t|kaqgaı}} → [kʰaŋ.gaɪ] ("to see")
: {{t|jaq de}} → [d͡ʑan.dɛ:] ("to be very beautiful")
: {{t|baq bego}} → [bam.bɛ.go] ("beech trees in general")
Again, these allophones are optional; it is acceptable to use [ŋ] in all positions.  


<!--
=== What are the words for the days of the week and for the months? ===
=== What are the words for the days of the week and for the months? ===
✅ The names for the days of the week are based on the colors of the rainbow, starting with red on Monday and ending with purple on Sunday:
✅ The names for the days of the week are based on the colors of the rainbow, starting with red on Monday and ending with purple on Sunday:
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| December  || {{t|heıgujue}}  
| December  || {{t|heıgujue}}  
|}
|}
-->


=== What's the difference between an indirect question and a {{t|ꝡé}} phrase? ===
<!--
✅ The distinction is extremely important logically speaking, but English usually conflates the two, so many people overlook the difference. The following example illustrates the difference:
# {{t|Dua jí ꝡä chı súq hí raı.}} = "I know ''what'' you believe"
# {{t|Dua jí ꝡé chı súq hóa.}} = "I ''know'' what you believe"
Let's say that what you believe is [God exists].
# says that I know that you believe [God exists], because I know what it is that you believe
# says that I know [God exists], because I know that which you believe.
 
=== Does Toaq have a flag? ===
=== Does Toaq have a flag? ===
✅ This is a candidate design:  
✅ This is a candidate design:  
Line 426: Line 335:
== References ==
== References ==
<references />
<references />
-->

Latest revision as of 23:35, 25 September 2024

This page answers some frequently asked questions about Toaq.

Getting started

Where do I start learning?

Try Toaq with Ease or the Grammar overview. The most complete resource is the refgram.

"Complementizer"? "Covert"? I don't understand the refgram at all!

Don't worry, that's okay! It was written for an audience of linguists, not language learners. Focus on the example sentences if you feel lost in the jargon. If you don't understand a concept, try searching this wiki. You can also ask questions on Discord.

How do I type the tone marks/symbols/diacritics?

See Input methods.

What's the word for...

You can look it up on Toadua, the community dictionary.

Speaking and writing

How many tones are there? What does each tone do?

There are four tones, but each one has various uses depending on the part of speech they are used with. Simplifying things a lot, falling tone is for particles and verbs, rising tone is for particles and (pro)nouns, glottal tone marks subordination, and hiatus tone is for adverbs. See Tone for a thorough overview.

How do you pronounce…?

Please refer to https://toaq.net/refgram/phonology/.

What's up with the letter q in this language? Pronunciation of q

q is somewhat special and its pronunciation may not be immediately obvious. It is pronounced like English ⟨ng⟩ (IPA [ŋ]). The use of the letter Q is a nod to Rex May’s Ceqli, an international auxiliary language with loglang elements; it’s also found in natural languages such as Fijian (where it represents [ᵑɡ], to be exact).

What's with the ı / i without dot / dotless i?

Writing ı without the dot distinguishes it more from an i that carries a tone mark, it also makes more room for an adjacent tone mark. Overall, it just makes things easier to read. See Latin writing system.

Grammar

Can I fill fewer slots than a verb has?

Probably! See Underfilling.

How do I skip slots? (What's the equivalent of Lojban's FA?)

While not an exact equivalent of Lojban’s FA, if you need to access the last slot of a verb, you can use Object incorporation. Alternatively, just fill the slots with pronouns.

How does bọ work? What is the meaning / place structure of bọdo?

Semi-officially, it moves the direct object to the front, and removes the old subject. See bo-.

How do numbers work?

The official number system is that numbers are just verbs: saq means "___ are three in number", so Saq jío means "the buildings are three" and sá jıo saq means "some buildings that are three" (three buildings).

A more elaborate unofficial number system is described at User:Loekıa/Numbers.

How do I refer back to sá without a following verb? Does it bind ráı?

No, you have to use hụ́sa.


Tools and resources

Is there a way to check whether my sentence is correct? / Is there a translator from Toaq to logic notation?

You can use Kuna's web interface here.

How can I join the Discord server?

Use this invite link.

Is there a frequency list?

Yes! See frequency-list.txt in the corpus repo.

Is there a list of translated sentences?

This spreadsheet has up-to-date example sentences in the "Refgram examples" and "A sentences" sheets.




Retrieved from "https://toaq.me/index.php?title=FAQ&oldid=2194"